UNBAN or don't, you should reevaluate your policies. Options

[Outraged Duff]

So one of your dutiful admins took upon themselves to ban me from all =SM= servers for chivalry. No this isn't a please unban me thread although i can see by these forums that this isn't an uncommon event.

This thread was created to question your entire approach with regards to moderation and how much it contradicts the very nature of the online community, and especially competitive multiplayer gaming.

If my memory serves me i was banned, cited as being racist. The actual 'racism' was my friends, and me being me i decided to stick up for my friend. I argued that merely saying the 'n' word does not make it racist. One of your admin informed me that saying the word makes anybody a racist. I counter argued by saying he had just used that word, therefore must also be a racist. To which they replied 'no' and promptly kicked me for being racist. Now may come across as smart ass -like on my part but it surely not kick and ban worthy?

People will be people, and gamers gamers. People will say stupid things, swear, trade insults, etc... you could police them, but it appears to me that you are rather heavy handed at it. I can accept that when i play online games, language, racism and homophobia invariably will happen. If i don't like that i would mute said players or switch of chat entirely. You are not the moral arbiters of the Chivalry community, you run a server. I stand by what i said because i know that I am not racist and wasnt trying to be deliberatly provactive about it either.

I will always use coarse language and occasionally fling insults around. Any other game this is accepted, i haven't ever been banned from any online game for the over 10 years i have been playing video games. For some reason Chivalry is different, i have lost count of the number of servers i have been banned from. Mostly i guess from rubbing people up the wrong way, or just friendly fire. At the end of the day i just want to play the game and have fun, and i am only writing this to appeal to your better nature to revert my ban and stop being so aggressive in banning other people.

There are very few good servers for Chivalry, i regarded yours as one of them until this unfortunate incident.

[MonkeyFiend]

Since this does come up from time to time, there's a post explaining the rationale of the rules here: http://www.sneakymonkeys.com/forums/index....c=1787&st=0

As mentioned in that post, using the N word does not necessarily make you a racist. However you weren't banned for being a racist.

The rules state 'Racist language (for any reason)= ban'

You used racist language, you got banned

An admin trying to explain the situation and administrate using it an example is allowed for simple common sense

If an admin uses racist language themselves (when not explaining the situation to a player) then simply put: they'll be removed from the clan and banned from the servers. The rules apply to everyone and if anything, more strictly to our own members.

I too will use course language and fling around insults. For the reasons stated in the linked post - this clan set, by majority vote, the no racist language rules back when we set up in 2006 playing BF2 (when the 24/7 karkand server was ranked in the world top 20) the rules were applied then too and in every game since.

[Outraged Duff]

Stick and stones...

My friend has Asperger's syndrome, saying no racist language is just a red rag to a bull with him. I really don't understand your logic behind banning people though, it doesn't stop anything. Racism and racist language will still happen. Personally the best way to stop racism is to devalue the words, they are just words don't let them control your views.

[Meowric]

Regarding sticks and stones, we're not implying we're butthurt, more that we find racist language distasteful.

Regarding friends with Aspergers, this (along with Tourette's and a variety of other ailments) has been used in the past as an excuse. Whether legit or not, we can't judge. This is why we stick to the letter of the law in respect of the rules, it's less open to interpretation.

We are not on a crusade to stop racism. We're just a bunch of players who are not particularly impressed by racist language and have chosen to put rules in place on our servers to remove players who chose to do so.

The rest of your comments focus around your own personal opinion, which you're entitled to. Ours is that we don't want people using racist language on the servers. The rules spam this all the damn time. You and your buddy used racist language. You got banned. Not sure there's any more to add

[TurboMidget]

To shed a bit more light on this, I banned him yesterday evening from the Carnage server after Pengu confirmed that he used previously mentioned racist language on the Limited server earlier that day. Pengu didn't feel comfortable making the call so I did. Usually bans only stick to one server, eventhough it should be extended to both because it's a hassle to do while playing. I trust Pengus word and decided to make use of this opportunity.

[HackedPenguin]

yes, I told Turbo that you were banned from limited archer, but I didn't want to ban you here because of my kind hearted nature and because I believe that ppl deserve another chance.

And also, we happened to play at the same time on EtErNal clans server. You asked me were you banned for the use of the 'n' word on our server, I told you that no racist language. Over the next few games, one word that came up in you text in the chat was the 'n' word. Quite much racist language. Simply put, we don't want racist ppl here, nor those who speak racist language.

[Outraged Duff]

And what language do racists speak?

I'm glad you clarify your position with regards to this matter. Frankly i find it quite funny that a white male 18 - 30 something clan such as yourselves choose to be moral arbiters for the rest of the gaming community. Its clear that your very righteous and naive about the gaming community as a whole, and no it isn't black and white.

Personally now i know to avoid your servers, because although i don't like racism, i certainly don't like over zealous admins. I play for fun, not to worry about what words i use and when i use them.

In fact i could even go so far as to be cliche and say some of my best friends are Asian, but it is clear to me that your kind (white male entitled gamers) wouldn't know what discrimination and hatred are all about. This is far as i'm willing to go with this subject but don't expect no kindness or courtesy if you stir up trouble in other servers. You have been warned.

[KMKZHomicide]

Going back to the term "Nigger" I would seriously like to smash this "Racist" quote on the head for all those people that actually find this racist you may be shocked to find out it generally isn't a racist term, examples: slaughterhouse house rules a brand new song by a rap group mentions "yes niggers we're back again" as their introduction line I would like to know if they we're to log into these amazing servers would you ban them? Eminem is also well known for his use of the term niggers and word nigger so would you ban him?

As admins it's not your place to decide if nigger as a racial word or not that is for the legal system and until they officially say nigger is racist it's not so please go back to filtering hackers and other abusive players and team killers.

Also if anyone throws abuse at me do I have the right to claim they are discriminating against me because I'm disabled seeing as I have Aspergers, If you want to play touchy with nigger then I can play ball with that surely?

Just remember it's not your job to enforce a law that isn't legally there let because I doubt anyone that admins these servers knows anything about laws and I wouldn't be shocked if one or more of you has voted for a "racist" party before so maybe you should include a full background check on the admins?

[MonkeyFiend]

Frankly i find it quite funny that a white male 18 - 30 something clan such as yourselves

Ahh so we can't have opinions on racial intolerance unless we're an ethnic minority ourselves? itdiotic statement

choose to be moral arbiters for the rest of the gaming community.

no. we set rules on our own private server, which we feel makes the community a more friendly place and help remove idiots (like yourselves). You broke them. you got banned.

Personally now i know to avoid your servers,

avoid? You're banned, so don't worry about it

i certainly don't like over zealous admins.

We only have 2 major rules, no intentional TKing and no racist language. Upholding these rules isn't over-zealous. It's simply upholding the very few rules we have that idiots choose to break

I play for fun, not to worry about what words i use and when i use them.

we play for fun. We also enjoy playing with people with a modicum of maturity and a basic level of intelligence to understand the concept of appropriate language for a games server

In fact i could even go so far as to be cliche and say some of my best friends are Asian, but it is clear to me that your kind (white male entitled gamers) wouldn't know what discrimination and hatred are all about.

Actually there are some ethnic minorities in this clan. However at the end of the day it wouldn't make any difference if there wasn't. Self-entitled? coming to the idiots that turn up to the server, break the few rules we have then bitch about it. heh, self-entitled: look in the mirror.

This is far as i'm willing to go with this subject but don't expect no kindness or courtesy if you stir up trouble in other servers. You have been warned.

Unsure of the meaning of this. Stir up trouble? You are the ones that broke the server rules and caused trouble and simply got banned for it.
BTW the official server have an even stricter interpretation of no racist language. So you'll get banned on an official server even faster than on here.
Trust me, go to the chivadmins steam group and ask one of the global mods/global server admins there.
Or feel free to PM me

Going back to the term "Nigger" I would seriously like to smash this "Racist" quote on the head for all those people that actually find this racist you may be shocked to find out it generally isn't a racist term, examples: slaughterhouse house rules a brand new song by a rap group mentions "yes niggers we're back again" as their introduction line I would like to know if they we're to log into these amazing servers would you ban them? Eminem is also well known for his use of the term niggers and word nigger so would you ban him?

As admins it's not your place to decide if nigger as a racial word or not that is for the legal system and until they officially say nigger is racist it's not so please go back to filtering hackers and other abusive players and team killers.

Just remember it's not your job to enforce a law that isn't legally there let because I doubt anyone that admins these servers knows anything about laws and I wouldn't be shocked if one or more of you has voted for a "racist" party before so maybe you should include a full background check on the admins?

I read through this but while I could come up with some good rebuttals (such as the fact there is a law against expressing hate language, in the UK at least where the server is based, but that's still tangential and irrelevant - much as your entire argument is).

It's not our job to enforce laws. It is however our choice to set up a private server, create a couple of basic rules (that already exist in all the official servers for this game) and uphold those rules. It's your choice whether to ignore them or not regardless of whether in fact your a racist or not. The simple fact is you broke the rules, you got banned.

we do actually do basic checks on the admins - just to get a feel for how they deal with disputes and insults etc., also to check for any history of bans. It helps keeps idiots (like yourselves) from joining.


Anyway, since I've seen nothing aside from a shocking naivety of opinions, the bans stand

[TurboMidget]

And what language do racists speak?

I dunno. Where are you from?

Unfortunately Monkey beat me to it (and quite good, too) but yeah, they're our servers. You don't get to play on our servers, we're letting you play on our servers. Well, we used to, anyway.

[KMKZHomicide]

QQ you know nothing about laws you monkeys (RACIST) go back to the ZOO

[Outraged Duff]

Just to address this issue that i'm some kind of racist idiot. I never said the word until the admin said the word and I pointed out that just using the word doesn't make you a racist seeing as he himself had used it. So just to clarify i never used the word but still got kicked. I just can't fathom why you ban people that would say a word, the same treatment i can assume you can give to hackers, deliberate teamkillers and complete arseholes. Its not even close to being on the same level.

If you don't believe me go and play any other game, even Chivalry and see what kind of language people use. Its nice to be nice, but i wouldn't be suprised if your servers became less and less frequented by people in the future.

[Outraged Duff]

I dunno. Where are you from?

Unfortunately Monkey beat me to it (and quite good, too) but yeah, they're our servers. You don't get to play on our servers, we're letting you play on our servers. Well, we used to, anyway.

Orginally Coventry, probably one of the UKs most multi cultural cities. You really are showing your ages/mentality with your comebacks. So when you get a real job and have to pay for the server out of something other than your parents trustfund what server will you hide on?

[AsDeR]

So, can we close this already?

[TurboMidget]

So, can we close this already?

Probably for the best, otherwise this will turn into one of those mud slinging threads like baba's.

[Muk]

Thanks you two for being such incredible vigilantes and trying to devalue the word nigger. Is it to make the world a better place? When that finally happens everyone can go around and call anyone they want a nigger and they will laugh back and say "thank you sir, I'm glad that word is meaningless now, you're a nigger too".

What fantasy world do you two live in? The rule is out of respect to everyone playing, not because we think you are being racist.

What are you two going to devalue next for the world? Pedophilia?

[KMKZHomicide]

I don't touch on anything except little boys

[Outraged Duff]

Thanks you two for being such incredible vigilantes and trying to devalue the word nigger. Is it to make the world a better place? When that finally happens everyone can go around and call anyone they want a nigger and they will laugh back and say "thank you sir, I'm glad that word is meaningless now, you're a nigger too".

What fantasy world do you two live in? The rule is out of respect to everyone playing, not because we think you are being racist.

What are you two going to devalue next for the world? Pedophilia?

Pretty sure only 'racist' words that get you banned, plenty of other people using other discriminatory words without consequence on your servers. I guess hypocrisy is what you know best, I shall bow to your ineffable wisdom.

[Muk]

More things than racist language can get you banned but i think you will find we have been talking about the racist language rule in particular if you got lost somewhere?

[MonkeyFiend]

Well everyone has had their say. Will close the topic there. The bans remain permanent.